The rarest palm in my collection

[sarasota alex]

Pogonotium ursinum

[richnorm]

I had to google the Genus!  Pretty little thing.

[Flow]

Beautiful, I have never evem heard of this one!

 

[Pando]

Wow, this thing is hard core. Even the leaflets have spines on top!...

[LJG]

7 hours ago, richnorm said:

I had to google the Genus!  Pretty little thing.

Me too. Never heard of this. 

[Pal Meir]

11 minutes ago, LJG said:

Me too. Never heard of this. 

It was before known as Daemonorops ursina and is a very friendly indoor palm like the other relatives of Daemonorops etc.

[Pando]

Cactii are friendly too!

[Palmaceae]

Very cool! How hardy is it?

[Cindy Adair]

New to me too. Thanks!

[Eric in Orlando]

Wow, cool and rare specimen! Despite their spininess I find the rattan palms fascinating.

The rarest I have ever grown has to be either Oncocalamus tuleyi, a climbing rattan from western tropical Africa or Voaniola gerardii. Both are no longer alive. Satranala decussilvae is probably the rarest I have living.

 

[sarasota alex]

2 hours ago, Palmaceae said:

Very cool! How hardy is it?

I'm nervous to find out  No cultivation record for this one

[sarasota alex]

39 minutes ago, Eric in Orlando said:

Wow, cool and rare specimen! Despite their spininess I find the rattan palms fascinating.

The rarest I have ever grown has to be either Oncocalamus tuleyi, a climbing rattan from western tropical Africa or Voaniola gerardii. Both are no longer alive. Satranala decussilvae is probably the rarest I have living.

 

Thanks Eric! I also love rattans! I even decided to select a beautiful infructescence of Daemonorops grandis as my avatar pic.

I was at Leu last June for an hour or so, when a meeting I was attending in Orlando unexpectedly got pushed back. The collection is amazing, although I didn't get enough time to see it all. Plectocomiopsis sp. you have there is definitely at the top of what I would consider rare genera list. You also have a species there that's on my "most wanted" list, and arguably the most beautiful of all non-climbing Calamus - Calamus castaneus.

Not sure what it is about Oncocalamus tuleyi. The Tropical Collection Curator at the Huntington Gardens also told me that they had one but couldn't keep it alive in the conservatory.

[sarasota alex]

Thanks for the comments everyone!

[PalmatierMeg]

I would assume no cold hardiness and move indoors if temp falls below 50F. It is cute. Its wall-to-wall spines remind me of a juvenile Acrocomia. How big does it get and does it climb?

[Pal Meir]

9 minutes ago, PalmatierMeg said:

I would assume no cold hardiness and move indoors if temp falls below 50F. It is cute. Its wall-to-wall spines remind me of a juvenile Acrocomia. How big does it get and does it climb?

No, it doesn’t climb. Cf. also Riffle & Craft (2003), p. 418 or Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogonotium.

[Pal Meir]

The newest name seems to be Calamus ursinus:

http://www.mapress.com/phytotaxa/content/2015/f/p00197p152f.pdf

[Eric in Orlando]

18 hours ago, sarasota alex said:

Thanks Eric! I also love rattans! I even decided to select a beautiful infructescence of Daemonorops grandis as my avatar pic.

I was at Leu last June for an hour or so, when a meeting I was attending in Orlando unexpectedly got pushed back. The collection is amazing, although I didn't get enough time to see it all. Plectocomiopsis sp. you have there is definitely at the top of what I would consider rare genera list. You also have a species there that's on my "most wanted" list, and arguably the most beautiful of all non-climbing Calamus - Calamus castaneus.

Not sure what it is about Oncocalamus tuleyi. The Tropical Collection Curator at the Huntington Gardens also told me that they had one but couldn't keep it alive in the conservatory.

I had 2 Oncocalamus plants. One was planted and the other kept in a container. The planted specimen never thrived and then slowly died. The other grew a bit but then quickly declined and died.

We also have Calamus erectus, another clumping, non-climbing rattan palm. It has very large, golden spines.

The Plectocomiopsis was grown from seed collected in Thailand. It has been in the ground since 2001. I am beginning to thing it is a Salacca as it has never tried to climb or produced cirri.

Another rare rattan we have planted out is Myrialepis paradoxa, seed came from RPS.

 

 

 

[sarasota alex]

On 11/25/2015, 8:50:29, Eric in Orlando said:

I had 2 Oncocalamus plants. One was planted and the other kept in a container. The planted specimen never thrived and then slowly died. The other grew a bit but then quickly declined and died.

We also have Calamus erectus, another clumping, non-climbing rattan palm. It has very large, golden spines.

The Plectocomiopsis was grown from seed collected in Thailand. It has been in the ground since 2001. I am beginning to thing it is a Salacca as it has never tried to climb or produced cirri.

Another rare rattan we have planted out is Myrialepis paradoxa, seed came from RPS.

 

I looked again at the photos I took of the Plectocomiopsis from Leu and I also don't believe it's what it is. Plectocomiopsis spp. have regularly arranged leaflets spreading in the same plane, which is not the case with your specimen. I also agree that it's probably a Salacca sp. My photos are not too detailed, but it looks like the apical leaflets are not split forming a wide leaflet - a characteristic of Salacca (although there are some exceptions, such as S. griffithii or S. secunda). There are only three Salacca spp. that could be found in the same area of Thailand where Plectocomiopsis spp. are also found - S. glabrescens, S. stolonifera, S. wallichiana. The only one that fits the description is Salacca glabrescens, so I would guess this is what you have.

I currently have 6 calamoid species in my living collection - Calamus aruensis, Daemonorops periacantha, Pogonotium ursinum, Salacca zalacca, Metroxylon vitiense and Mauritiella armata. Mauritiella armata is so far the only one in the ground. One of the first palms I planted in the new yard. Trying to repeat the success I had with that species in my previous yard I sold, where I've had it in the ground for over 3 years and it's 8' tall now.

[sarasota alex]

On 11/24/2015, 5:35:22, Pal Meir said:

The newest name seems to be Calamus ursinus:

http://www.mapress.com/phytotaxa/content/2015/f/p00197p152f.pdf

Well... kinda... but not exactly. It's a very valid statement to make based on the linked publication, however it's not accepted by some top palm botanists. John Dransfield, for example, published a response commentary to this article in the spring issue of Palms (https://www.palms.org/palmsjournal/2015/Vol59n1p51.pdf) where he calls the lumping of Daemonorops, Ceratolobus and Pogonotium into Calamus - "premature taxonomic changes, based on limited sampling". Dr. Dransfield also writes that "Herbarium curators will be forgiven for continuing to maintain the old genera". So I'm following his advice and maintaining the old genera  

[Pal Meir]

3 hours ago, sarasota alex said:

Well... kinda... but not exactly. It's a very valid statement to make based on the linked publication, however it's not accepted by some top palm botanists. John Dransfield, for example, published a response commentary to this article in the spring issue of Palms (https://www.palms.org/palmsjournal/2015/Vol59n1p51.pdf) where he calls the lumping of Daemonorops, Ceratolobus and Pogonotium into Calamus - "premature taxonomic changes, based on limited sampling". Dr. Dransfield also writes that "Herbarium curators will be forgiven for continuing to maintain the old genera". So I'm following his advice and maintaining the old genera  

The Goddess Palmarum will forgive you. ( or ?)

[Eric in Orlando]

On 11/28/2015, 1:42:15, sarasota alex said:

I looked again at the photos I took of the Plectocomiopsis from Leu and I also don't believe it's what it is. Plectocomiopsis spp. have regularly arranged leaflets spreading in the same plane, which is not the case with your specimen. I also agree that it's probably a Salacca sp. My photos are not too detailed, but it looks like the apical leaflets are not split forming a wide leaflet - a characteristic of Salacca (although there are some exceptions, such as S. griffithii or S. secunda). There are only three Salacca spp. that could be found in the same area of Thailand where Plectocomiopsis spp. are also found - S. glabrescens, S. stolonifera, S. wallichiana. The only one that fits the description is Salacca glabrescens, so I would guess this is what you have.

I currently have 6 calamoid species in my living collection - Calamus aruensis, Daemonorops periacantha, Pogonotium ursinum, Salacca zalacca, Metroxylon vitiense and Mauritiella armata. Mauritiella armata is so far the only one in the ground. One of the first palms I planted in the new yard. Trying to repeat the success I had with that species in my previous yard I sold, where I've had it in the ground for over 3 years and it's 8' tall now.

It does seem Salacca glabrescens matches up with it. Good to have a tentative name for it! It survived the 2009-10 winter with minor burn as did the mature clump of Salacca wallichiana. I also had Salacca magnifica and S. zalacca planted nearby but they died from the 2009-10 winter.

[Jeff Searle]

I have a couple of new Licualas in my collection now. First, Licuala terengganuensis which is from the Malay peninsula. It's planted in the yard and is approx. 2' in height. Also, I have some small L. bachmaensis from Vietnam. These have an impressive looking leaf. Also, my Hydriastele selibicum is now about 7' and is doing well.

[John Case]

Mine is the Douglas mutant....

[Ben in Norcal]

7 minutes ago, John Case said:

Mine is the Douglas mutant....

This one is exceedingly rare because no one wants it in their yard. Talk about getting hit with the ugly stick...

[John Case]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder....I saw no rules on beauty, just rarity! :)

[Ben in Norcal]

Just now, John Case said:

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder....I saw no rules on beauty, just rarity! :)

He he.  I'm just playing.  I keep teasing Patric that he needs to stop trying to get me to take one of those off his hands, as well...I'm not that altruistic! 

[sarasota alex]

2 hours ago, Jeff Searle said:

I have a couple of new Licualas in my collection now. First, Licuala terengganuensis which is from the Malay peninsula. It's planted in the yard and is approx. 2' in height. Also, I have some small L. bachmaensis from Vietnam. These have an impressive looking leaf. Also, my Hydriastele selibicum is now about 7' and is doing well.

Cool! Do you have any pictures Jeff?

[Jeff Searle]

Sorry I do not. I'm that lazy.....

[Eric in Orlando]

19 hours ago, Jeff Searle said:

I have a couple of new Licualas in my collection now. First, Licuala terengganuensis which is from the Malay peninsula. It's planted in the yard and is approx. 2' in height. Also, I have some small L. bachmaensis from Vietnam. These have an impressive looking leaf. Also, my Hydriastele selibicum is now about 7' and is doing well.

 

 

I got some seed of   Licuala terengganuensis but no germination yet. It looks to be a really nice species.